Preview: Seattle Police Chief Shon Barnes Has Left the Building, Part Deux

[00:00:00] Hey, Seattle Nice listeners. This is a special free preview of a members-only episode where we talk in more depth about what happened with Police Chief Sean Barnes now that he officially resigned. There were a number of things that we did not know when our episode aired on Friday, so this episode gets into all of those, including the $700,000 settlement, Mayor Wilson and kind of what's happening with her communications team. Was Sean Barnes ever the right match for Seattle's political landscape in the past?

[00:00:30] first place? And what about this new interim police chief? So we get into a lot in this new episode that you would not have heard in part one that aired on Friday. If you want to get in on that and you're not yet a member, support local journalism, help us make the jump to video by going to patreon.com slash Seattle Nice and becoming a member of this podcast and getting in on these special members-only episodes. We try not to paywall too many episodes, so help us continue to keep doing that because

[00:01:00] It's costing us quite a bit more to make that jump to video and we really want to do that. So we're kind of making a final push here Thanks to everybody who has supported it If you've been thinking about supporting the podcast and haven't yet had a chance to do that, do it now And if you can't do that, uh, i've got another suggestion for you Make sure that you subscribe to this podcast wherever you get your podcast. So if it's apple It's that little plus sign that you have to click to be a subscriber

[00:01:26] So it automatically downloads to your podcast app every week. Okay, here's the show Hello and welcome to the latest edition of Seattle Nice the only podcast that tells you what's really happening in seattle politics I'm david hyde with Erica C. Barnett of Publicola who I actually ran into at the grocery store

[00:01:55] Listeners where she had her earbuds in i'm picturing like like a reporter's notebook as well I don't know that there really was there literally was one. Yeah, well, she was grocery shopping while she was grocery shopping And i'm like, holy shit, you know, you want to know the hardest working, um reporter in town barely time to do that um, so, uh, welcome you were interviewing the lettuce I was literally I was literally on a call

[00:02:22] Um about the stuff we're going to talk about today. Uh, and I and I had been, uh, Stymied from doing any of my errands for hours Because I kept getting calls and so so you're multi-time So impressive also with us political consultant, uh, Sandeep Kaushik who i'm sorry sandy if i didn't know that There was going to be impromptu meeting at the grocery store, but eric and I later, um spoke about the podcast briefly Was that a quarrel? Yeah

[00:02:50] It just shows how how fucking bougie we both are we ran into each other at the ballard market Oh, I wasn't going to confess to that Um, at least we weren't at the metropolitan market or Uh, pcc no nothing wrong with any of these fine establishments, but on today's show seattle police chief sean barnes has officially resigned Uh, listeners to our last episode will know that we were taping sort of in the middle of the chaos on thursday Publicola had not yet confirmed that barnes was gone

[00:03:20] But now we know a lot more in part thanks to some of erica's grocery store reporting She also intended the barnes press conference. Um, but I want to start with the mayor Uh, who has also now explained her decision store sort of right erica? Um, it was the right decision quote unquote the right decision at the right time Yeah, I mean her decision was sort of um abrupt

[00:03:44] Um in that there was you know a mass shooting over the weekend at seattle center that we've talked about in our last episode And barnes is sort of reaction to it reaction to the reaction to it and the fact that he was out of town Um, I think really set off this chain of events where she decided she had to fire him But I do think that you know as she said at her press conference yesterday and this kind of got buried because You know the tv media were all up their own asses about

[00:04:13] You know not getting to talk to her sooner But um, you know, she said look there I know a little bit more about the police chief and the workings of the police department as the executive Than the city council, which you know, is pretty pissed at her and you know And I think this had actually been a long time coming I think there's you know, i've been reporting on barnes's tenure and Just some of the stuff that he's done As police chief um and some of the controversies he's been involved in including being out of town a lot of the time and so

[00:04:42] You know, was it the right time? I mean, I don't know. I think that, um, it might have been It might have behooved the mayor to wait a little bit to just kind of file away in her mind that um She's gonna get rid of him and that this is going to be part of the reason but uh, but not do it right away because it did look very reactive And and and that point about her knowing a little bit more about the police chief than the city council does that was in reference to the fact that the city council had been criticizing her uh over this decision

[00:05:13] Yeah, they've they've been like just absolutely on her ass about it I mean even the ones that uh, basically are support her because they're more progressive Have criticized the lack of information coming out of the mayor's office, you know to them not necessarily to the public, but uh, but yes, uh five members of the council Uh so far have been uh pretty critical of this decision, which is interesting because I didn't realize they loved sean barnes before this But suddenly they do

[00:05:38] Everyone seems to be flip-flopping on their opinion about barnes seem to totally blame him for the shooting initially and now they It seems to love him. But sandeep kashik. What do you think? Well, first of all, let's just say this is the capstone of uh, we're taping this on saturday, uh, the capstone of one of the craziest weeks at city hall that you know It's in my my time around here. I was trying to think of like a

[00:06:04] A close analogy maybe at the height of like the craziness in the summer of 2020 There might have been a week this batch Like there was a week Ed murray. I mean ed murray Yeah, I had to resign over like over child abuse allegations. I mean that was a crazy I mean we've had crazy weeks before i'll just say I think that was worse Those are the two I was I was about to say before you interrupted me there were two

[00:06:29] There was in the middle of the summer of 2020 when I think three council members like demanded that jenny durkin resign Immediately like there was there was a week there where things were kind of completely chaotic and crazy But yes, also in the Terrible period in 2017 around ed murray's resignation. There were probably so anyway

[00:06:49] But it this is up there right like and this is this is like a week of like a cascading series and multiple layers of just fuck up after fuck up like in Handling First the initial aftermath of the shooting Then to layer on to this this I wasn't you know, kind of kind of sort of react I mean, it was like incredibly Abrupt decision in the middle of this

[00:07:15] Still live situation where they're investigating this mass shooting For the mayor to kind of pull this trigger but not pull this trigger as we talked about in our last super heavy duty emergency episode Like where we didn't even know what the fuck was going on almost 24 hours after suppose, you know, the rumors were swirling that this was happening and so And then you top it off with the latest news with you know what the settlement was to get barns to go and you know

[00:07:44] And and it just holy fucking shit Erica you reported that let's hear let's hear more about this settlement because it raised some eyebrows Yeah, the settlement the total amount of the settlement works out to seven hundred thousand dollars, which includes The the money that he got as moving costs, which is somewhat ironic I mean, he does live in an apartment here But his primary residence meaning the house that he owns and where his wife and children live

[00:08:13] Is in chicago and you know listeners will know that this was part of the The controversy is you know, he is out of town I mean something like a quarter of the time Um to a third of the time depending on you know, what you're looking at Um, what periods you're looking at so out of town a lot. Um And anyway, he got sixty thousand dollars for relocation costs to move here and he got fifty thousand dollars as a bonus that was intended for

[00:08:40] uh, basically lateral police officers during a time when the police department said they were in a hiring crisis Barnes took that bonus. Um, and I broke that news last year Um, and then on top of that he's getting, um, you know A cash payout that will work out to a total of seven hundred thousand dollars Which you know is basically like getting two-year salary. Um, and he didn't even work here for two years. So, uh, It's a it's a pretty

[00:09:08] Outrageous amount of money that, um, you know My interpretation of it is like look this is obviously So that he doesn't sue. Um, he was communicating yesterday Um, on friday through an employment lawyer. So there were there was a statement from him Um, might have been on thursday. Uh, but anyway this week He had a statement through an employment lawyer. So he's obviously, um, you know working those angles and got a

[00:09:33] extremely generous settlement, um to uh, to leave the city and I Assume leave the city alone and not sue them as well Is there any is there any possible possible mathematical calculation where this astronomical figure Is somehow justified the city could say oh, well, we you know, we actually saved money by spending seven hundred thousand dollars here It seems like a lot Yeah, that's what i'm saying Like if he had sued he could have gotten more money But you know, I mean you look at some of the settlements that other police who have sued for

[00:10:02] You know, I would say probably more legitimate reasons Around um discrimination and and you know They're they're not um, they're not that much He might have gotten a million bucks, but like I don't know, right? But it costs the city a lot of money to pay lawyers. It's not just the settlement I mean, it's like you gotta hire outside lawyers and I mean the the the litigation costs that the city pays for uh, for spd suits for sdot suits It can be a lot Very very high Yeah, okay

[00:10:30] So I think they probably did save money, but it still looks outrageous I think yeah, it does look it is outrageous I I mean the reason he got the settlement I I would argue is again the on You know as we understand the timeline of what happened the mayor Called him in on Wednesday late on wednesday and Demanded he resign and then he Defied her and said no He would not resign

[00:11:00] And then she didn't fire him And basically created this created a situation where he had her over a barrel where there's rumors are swirling City hall is in chaos. It looks like no one's in control Is he the chief? Is he not the fucking chief? Like what the fuck is going on? Like every hour is in you know Increasing kind of political disaster for her and the black community does this um

[00:11:28] Rally on thursday morning where they come to city hall. She meets with them they they You know Strongly ask her not to fire barns To be clear. This is a group of Of uh, of People who you know by and large supported bruce harrell I would not say the black community met with her I would say a faction Uh, that has a certain political Uh, angle well we're representing like the naacp the urban league some ministers right I mean

[00:11:58] Yes, the the kind of institutional black community whatever you want to Uh, you know append on to that but nonetheless like like like like this is going on right and and meanwhile he's holding out So what is what's she gonna do at that point either? I mean she could have I suppose just fired him But I guess she didn't want to do that She rather wanted to try to find some face-saving way out and so she signed off on this You know massive freaking settlement like it's it's not good right?

[00:12:26] It's not even by seattle standards and there have been lots of these kinds of seattle municipal government has this tradition where People you know don't leave voluntarily and often do like, you know sue and they get settlements and stuff like that But even by those standards, this is eye-popping What about this piece of it where? She's being pressed by reporters katie wilson's being pressed, you know, why now? Et cetera and she's not really answering the question

[00:12:53] How do you both kind of read that she's saying this is happening a high level? I can't really discuss that She could have said for legal reasons. I can't discuss it, but that's not what she said So I was a little bit confused by that. She didn't say that insight. She did also say for yeah she did also say that I mean here's the thing like the Reaction of the press and and this is gonna i'll come back to trying to answer your question But like the reaction of the mainstream media and the reaction of the city council

[00:13:22] Have both been how dare this woman fire the police chief. She does not have the right And if she and if she does want to fire the police chief she needs to tell us every single like Detail of the conversations that happened in the background Which I think is double standard or at least a different standard than other You know other mayors who have fired police chiefs

[00:13:46] Bruce harrell fired a police chief. I mean we are we we have a long and rich history of mayors firing police chiefs In the city and I think this also goes to the way that they reacted they being the city council in this case When and the media to when she fired the chief, uh, or sorry The director of city light There's kind of the sense that like she doesn't have a right to fire department heads And uh, and I just I find that really bizarre And I mean eric I don't want yeah

[00:14:14] Diaz got fired for reasons that we all knew under bruce harrell there was that so where's the double standard? Reasons that we all knew because of reporting not because bruce harrell told us I mean the reasons that we were that We were aware of all the stuff that was swirling around diaz, you know the affair and the lies and the cover-up That was because of people's reporting. It was not including mine He admitted that that that diaz had Lied to him and stuff like that didn't he I mean I'm sure I mean that yes, okay

[00:14:43] I mean, but there was not this chorus of I mean if you look at the What deborah war is is saying a council member what joy hollingsworth is saying there is a real sense that they do not believe that She has the right to make this kind of executive decision without their permission somehow And if they disagree with it, you know, I mean I I was hearing rumors and I don't know if this is true But like they're gonna fuck with whoever she appoints as police chief because they're mad about this

[00:15:11] and so, you know, I just I I think the the reaction has been outsized and so getting getting back to the media I mean, I do think that a lot of the mainstream folks uh tv in particular have been Pissed about Not having more information directly from the mayor But I think that actually kind of extends to or is based on another thing that they're really pissed about which is Legitimate and not legitimate, which is that, you know, they wanted information sooner and I think that I think that broadly is totally legitimate like we waited

[00:15:40] almost 24 hours before um, the settlement was finally signed and the mayor, you know said something about it and rumors had been swirling now I think in retrospect the source of those rumors, um, it should be uh called into question You know, I uh, I Am very curious where they originally came from and if they were, um, perhaps, you know And i'm not saying this is true, but that it's possible that they were originating in uh barnes's office Which would be beneficial to him? Um, wait, wait, which rumors?

[00:16:10] The rumors that he was had been fired Because, you know, because I will say like the the people that were telling me about it were mostly sort of more uh barnes aligned um So but anyway, I mean I just I think that, you know, there was a problem with information not getting out Um, because the rumors started swirling. I reported on them Everybody reported on them. Uh, and then wilson didn't say anything for almost 24 hours That said Oh my god some of these

[00:16:36] TV reporters in particular are such fucking babies like You know, they were really mad that wilson was not doing interviews with them uh on uh friday And you know, she did do interviews with four reporters one of them was me and you know, there's also the seattle times kaw and kink five and you know the rest of the the rest of the tv people were standing around city hall all day bitching about

[00:17:03] Why isn't why is katie only talking to special reporters? Why isn't she talking to us? um I'm sorry because like my experience in this city for the whole time i've been here is that Mayors don't talk to me they talk to all all those guys and so you know, the tables are turned on one instance and I think that The fact that they're so pissed about that is reflected in their coverage. I think that You know, there's just there's just no there's no way to really separate how annoyed they are at not getting special treatment

[00:17:32] From the way that they're covering her Porter reporters are vain vain creatures It's not even being vain. It's like It's like why why don't things get spoon-fed to us by this mayor the way they got spoon-fed by the previous mayors? I mean bruce harrell never did one single interview with me in his four years in office And so like boo fucking who that I got an interview and you didn't chris daniels

[00:17:57] But well, that was that was shitty media and press management by bruce harrell And I think there was lots of shitty media and press management by the Katie wilson administration over the course of this week again on multiple occasions and and multiple different times, um, you know Leading to this kind of cascading series of just you know from bad to worse kind of um sense of

[00:18:24] Lack of control lack of command lack of kind of understanding uh, uh Lack of information lack of very lack of I don't know what On the council side, I will say this The mayor didn't have a lot of runway coming into this with the council, right? I mean part of what the situation here that we've amply documented on previous episodes of seattle nice is that relationships between the mayor's office on the seventh floor and the council Has been

[00:18:54] Breaking down and it's continued to break down. I mean just like we've forgotten it now, but there was just as What seemed at the time like this massive controversy over Free school meals where the mayor kind of turned on the outside groups to pound on the council and And so anyway I guess what she won Yeah, yeah So yes, she did win, but i'm what i'm saying at what cost to her relationships

[00:19:19] With with with council members on the second floor and so some of that is coming home to roost now now there's a Crisis the mayor's fucking up and there's not a lot of um Desire on the part of council members to kind of cut her some slack on this right? I think that um, that played into the and and it is it was a vehement reaction from the council, right? Okay, I question for sunday like What do you think she should have done differently? So so she's in a position where she can't

[00:19:49] You know say Sean barnes has resigned because he hasn't resigned For you know that 18 hours or whatever and and they're they're working on a settlement They signed it at 3 30 the announcement goes out at 3 30. I mean basically around the same time. What should she have done different? Well, um First of all, okay, everyone that's it for our special free preview of this members only episode If you want to hear the whole thing and support

[00:20:15] Independent local journalism join us at patreon.com Slash seattle nice that's patreon.com Slash seattle nice and for everyone. Thank you so much for listening