Progressives pan Mayor Harrell's budget. Plus, debate watch party!

[00:00:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, Seattle Nice listeners, before we get going on this week's scintillating show, and

[00:00:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean scintillating, we just wanted to invite all of you and your friends to a special debate

[00:00:15] [SPEAKER_02]: watch party this Tuesday, October 1st at Town Hall. We're gonna be kicking it off at 6 p.m.

[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_02]: with a live stream of the big vice presidential showdown between J.D. Vance and Tim Walls,

[00:00:26] [SPEAKER_02]: which isn't that important, unless you care about the future of democracy or whatever. Come

[00:00:31] [SPEAKER_02]: hang out with us. Their cafe is gonna be open serving drinks and stuff, and right after that,

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_02]: stick around for the big Seattle City Council debate this year between Tanya Woo and Alexis

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Mercedes Rink. This is a citywide seat. You're not gonna wanna miss it. For tickets, just

[00:00:46] [SPEAKER_02]: go to Town Hall's website or also put a link in the show notes for this episode. And

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_02]: also a link for a place where you can submit questions for the city council candidates

[00:00:55] [SPEAKER_02]: if you like. Unfortunately, we can't provide that service for the vice presidential debate

[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_02]: this time anyway. Again, that's happening this Tuesday, October 1st at Town Hall. Really hope

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_02]: to see you there. Here's the show.

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Hello and welcome to the latest edition of Seattle Nice. I'm David Hyde here,

[00:01:22] [SPEAKER_02]: as we always are with Erica C Barnett of Publicola. Hi, Erica.

[00:01:27] [SPEAKER_00]: Hi, David. You sound so solemn.

[00:01:29] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's a solemn day because I'm gonna say in a minute why about what we're gonna be talking

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_02]: about, but also with us political consultant Sandeep Kashik. Hey. How's it going, Sandeep?

[00:01:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm feeling very appropriately solemn right now.

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_02]: The reason I'm sounding solemn is because we're talking about Mayor Harreyl's budget

[00:01:47] [SPEAKER_02]: proposal. And it's just like one of those topics where listeners might be thinking,

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_02]: oh, fuck, super interesting. Maybe I should go balance my checkbook instead or I got other things

[00:01:57] [SPEAKER_02]: to do. But to me, the budget is super interesting because this is where kind of all the political

[00:02:02] [SPEAKER_02]: rhetoric that we've been hearing from the Harreyl administration and this new city council

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_02]: kind of falls away. And they're actually starting to take more action than we've seen

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_02]: potentially in budgets. Or am I wrong about that, Erica? Like, budgets? Like how much

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_02]: do budgets matter? Am I getting too excited?

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_00]: I think budgets are probably the most important thing that the city council and the mayor do

[00:02:22] [SPEAKER_00]: every year because, you know, when you hear all that rhetoric, a lot of times it's about

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_00]: spending. And we're gonna put more money on this and we're gonna cut this thing we think

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_00]: is bullshit. And, you know, and we're gonna do all this stuff. And the budget is where

[00:02:34] [SPEAKER_00]: they actually do it. So I think it is very exciting.

[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Sandeep, do you agree or disagree?

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_01]: I totally agree. I bet, you know, look, I'm a nerd on this stuff. I've helped to

[00:02:41] [SPEAKER_01]: write budget speeches, right? You know, which oh god, okay, I'm getting bored already.

[00:02:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Jesus. All right. All right, that said, I guess we should be clear upfront that the

[00:02:50] [SPEAKER_02]: city council is the one that controls the purse strings. So essentially Erica,

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_02]: the mayor's budget is like what? It's like the start of the conversation. The opening salvo.

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_00]: It's a moral document, David, don't you know?

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. A moral document.

[00:03:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is ordinarily the opening salvo. And I think that this budget will change.

[00:03:09] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think probably since the mayor and council's priorities are largely in lockstep,

[00:03:13] [SPEAKER_00]: it's going to change a lot less than it has in recent years.

[00:03:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and to be clear about this too is typically, you know, it's always the mayor that proposes

[00:03:22] [SPEAKER_01]: the budget in the third week of, you know, typically the third week of September. And

[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_01]: then there's a budget process that goes until essentially Thanksgiving, right?

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_01]: When they complete the final budget. And there will be, there's always changes, but,

[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_01]: you know, they're typically on the margins, right? The core of the budget that gets

[00:03:41] [SPEAKER_01]: proposed by the mayor is typically adopted by the council. And then they,

[00:03:45] [SPEAKER_02]: The mayor does a lot of work.

[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:03:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. Because the budget office is housed on the executive side, right? And they're the ones who

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_01]: kind of pull together the initial, you know, mayoral proposal for the budget. And

[00:03:59] [SPEAKER_01]: that they just have more kind of, they also have access to all the departments,

[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_01]: which are part of the executive right and are answering to the budget office about what

[00:04:07] [SPEAKER_01]: their needs are. So they collect up all of the kind of initial foundational information that

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_01]: goes into the mayor's budget proposal.

[00:04:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And Erica, in your incredible article about the budget on Publicola, one of the finest

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_02]: that I read this week in our

[00:04:22] [SPEAKER_00]: You sound so sarcastic, but I'm quite proud of it.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_02]: news environment. I'm not being sarcastic for God's sakes. Sarcastic.

[00:04:28] [SPEAKER_02]: You're a shitty, shitty article.

[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_02]: You're hurting my feelings.

[00:04:32] [SPEAKER_02]: But no, I'm not being sarcastic in this instance. But you explain that or I'm not

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_02]: being sarcastic yet, I should say. You explained that Mayor Bruce Harrell's proposed budget

[00:04:42] [SPEAKER_02]: manages to avoid major cuts. So that must mean you're a huge fan of this budget proposal.

[00:04:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, to be clear, I'm not against major cuts in some areas. But no, I mean,

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_00]: the reason the rest of that sentence, which is the first sentence of the story that you're

[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_00]: praising, I hope you I hope you read a little further is that he's repurposing almost,

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, a majority of the money that was supposed to go to affordable housing,

[00:05:09] [SPEAKER_00]: Green New Deal jobs and equitable development as well as small businesses under the jumpstart

[00:05:15] [SPEAKER_00]: tax. And so this is the tax we've talked about it before that is paid by employers on

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_00]: highly compensated employees. A lot of it comes from Amazon. We don't know exactly how

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_00]: much. But the idea originally was these companies are affecting the economy, they're skewing,

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, housing prices, they're making things more expensive. So let's do something to address

[00:05:35] [SPEAKER_00]: it and let's charge them for it. So as I said, the majority of that money is now going to the

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_00]: general fund. So instead of paying for those four priorities, it's paying for, you know, fire,

[00:05:45] [SPEAKER_00]: police, cops, transportation, whatever. And they're going to have to change the law to

[00:05:51] [SPEAKER_00]: allow that. This is, you know, it's never been used to this extent before there's about 85 million

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_00]: or so that can legally go to the general fund now. But this, you know, huge repurposing of a

[00:06:02] [SPEAKER_00]: majority of the funding is new. And it's, you know, it's pretty audacious, I would say if not

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_02]: outrageous. Sadeep Bruce, read my lips, no new taxes, Harold saying here that he wants to take

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_02]: money out of the jumpstart fund to balance the budget. And I'm wondering, like, why do that?

[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Before we get into the details, I just let's get right into it. Like, why shouldn't this

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_02]: mayor and this council raise taxes on big business or capital gains or something like that rather

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_02]: than paying for it this way? Why do it this way? Why are they doing it this way? Should they

[00:06:36] [SPEAKER_01]: be doing it this way? Yeah, because I'll tell you one big reason why they should do it this

[00:06:41] [SPEAKER_01]: way is because contrary to all of the, you know, claims and hype over the course of this year

[00:06:48] [SPEAKER_01]: that the city is facing this huge, you know, $250, $260 million budget deficit that, you know,

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_01]: without new taxes is going to lead to, you know, deep cross the board cuts or, you know,

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_01]: vital programs or very, very, you know, beneficial programs all, you know,

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_01]: potentially being on the chopping block. None of that happened, right? I mean, the story with this

[00:07:14] [SPEAKER_00]: budget proposal- Yeah, because they stole money from those dedicated by law to a certain purpose.

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but the story of this budget proposal is that it was the dog that not only didn't

[00:07:24] [SPEAKER_01]: bite, it did barely bark, right? I mean, this is a pretty status quo budget that kind of funds

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_01]: everything that had previously been funded out of Jumpstart, but is using the delta between what the

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_01]: projections were for what Jumpstart revenues were going to be versus what actually came in

[00:07:45] [SPEAKER_00]: to, you know, backfill a hole in the budget. Yeah, I mean, that is really alighting like the

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_00]: fact that they're going to have to change a law that was adopted specifically to prevent this

[00:07:56] [SPEAKER_00]: exact thing from happening because first of all, I want to go back to, you know, you said what was

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_00]: projected. So the mayor has not yet provided any justification that I have heard of and I've asked

[00:08:08] [SPEAKER_00]: for it for taking a 2020 estimate before the, before this tax even started getting collected

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_00]: that most advocates for the tax at the time said was way too low. But nonetheless, that's

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_00]: the city said it was probably going to be estimating as conservatively as possible.

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_00]: So that estimate was based on no tax revenues having been collected at all and it went up,

[00:08:33] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, slowly over, over the years and it has been wildly wrong since the very first day

[00:08:38] [SPEAKER_00]: these tax dollars started coming in. So choosing it as an as a baseline now is arbitrary and

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_00]: it's designed to have as low a baseline as possible. So I think saying, oh, we got to

[00:08:49] [SPEAKER_00]: just base it on the 2020 estimate, we don't budget that way on anything else in the city.

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_00]: The city does its economic forecast four times a year. I mean, nothing else in the city is done

[00:08:59] [SPEAKER_00]: this way except for this one thing. And I will say that that actually has an impact because,

[00:09:05] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, it starts at 2020 and then it estimates a 2.5% inflation from 2020 on.

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_00]: And we know very well that inflation was not 2.5% during, you know, the pandemic years

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and after. And then in fact, the cost of affordable housing construction, which is the

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_00]: main thing jumpstart funds has gone up way higher than that. So every year, you know,

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_00]: it is funding less and less housing, you know, while the mayor and the council come in and say,

[00:09:33] [SPEAKER_00]: oh, look, free money. And, you know, the mayor even called it extra money in his budget speech,

[00:09:38] [SPEAKER_00]: but it isn't extra money. It's money that's coming out of this dedicated source.

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Erica, the argument you're making and that I keep hearing kind of from the

[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_01]: progressive left side of this equation is that, you know, back in 2020 when this

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_01]: tax was originally passed, that previous council led by Teresa Mosqueda sort of created a dedicated

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_01]: fund for jumpstart revenues and wrote a spending plan back then of how they and that council

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_01]: wanted to spend that money. And what I keep hearing is that somehow this was like, you know,

[00:10:11] [SPEAKER_01]: God speaking to Moses on the mountain is literally in the law.

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And right, right. They passed a law. They passed a law. You know, Teresa Mosqueda's wish list that

[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_01]: she passed in the law with her previous council is are you against affordable housing?

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Not against affordable housing. But these seem like priorities of the current council,

[00:10:27] [SPEAKER_00]: supposedly, and the mayor. He talked a lot about housing. And these aren't this isn't a crazy

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_00]: wish list, is my point. It's affordable housing. Yeah, I think some very large percentage

[00:10:37] [SPEAKER_00]: of it is affordable housing. That's the main thing at funds.

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Sure. But you're not saying, Erica, that Teresa Mosqueda was God speaking to Moses here.

[00:10:44] [SPEAKER_00]: No, the council passed a law and now if this current council wants to undo that law,

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_00]: which they clearly do, and if the mayor wants to undo that law, I think that it is reasonable.

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_00]: And it is in fact fiscally responsible for residents of the city to say,

[00:11:00] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, hey, why are we changing that law? Why are we taking a majority of this fund,

[00:11:06] [SPEAKER_00]: which again was founded on a nexus between Amazon and other big businesses driving up housing costs

[00:11:11] [SPEAKER_00]: and using it on, you know, for example, police emphasis patrols.

[00:11:16] [SPEAKER_02]: And Erica, beyond that, there are also budget cuts here, right? It's not just this reallocation

[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_02]: of jumpstart that there's clearly some hot, hot disagreement about. There's also

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_02]: there's also some budget cutting occurring here. Correct.

[00:11:29] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's I mean, overall the budget's going up because the mayor is spending a lot

[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_00]: more money on his priorities. So, you know, it provides, I mean, again, just to go back to jump

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_00]: start for a second, this extra money provides a pillow for the mayor to kind of continue

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_00]: stuffing the budget with stuff. So it's not really a very fiscally conservative budget,

[00:11:47] [SPEAKER_00]: but there are there are some cuts. There's 76 people who are going to lose their jobs out

[00:11:51] [SPEAKER_00]: of 159 positions overall. So, you know, you're talking about things that as the mayor put

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_00]: it won't be public facing, which I thought was a really, I don't know, almost a very

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_00]: transparent way of saying, you know, I'm not going to do anything that's going to be

[00:12:05] [SPEAKER_00]: obvious to you in the way that it harms the city. But, you know, they're cutting all

[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_00]: workforce development. They're cutting all equity programs at the Department of Human

[00:12:15] [SPEAKER_00]: Resources and just saying, oh, all the departments can just somehow take care of that themselves.

[00:12:19] [SPEAKER_00]: They're cutting all original Seattle channel programming, including the city inside out

[00:12:24] [SPEAKER_00]: program hosted by Brian Kalanen and, you know, just cutting six positions from the

[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_00]: Seattle channel for good, just to save $1.6 million, which I think is, you know, an incredible shame.

[00:12:36] [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, there's quite a few cuts. Most of them are kind of internal. Oh, and they're also cutting

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_00]: IT so that, you know, people within the city, you know, Sunday, if you talk to people on

[00:12:46] [SPEAKER_00]: the second floor in the seventh floor, you know, I talked to people in the municipal

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_00]: tower and like the IT department is already way overstrapped. They can't get their stuff

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_00]: fixed. You know, I mean, the city is obviously subject to ransomware attacks

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_00]: and they're cutting back all the internal IT divisions to the deep state. Erica,

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_00]: you're chatteling the deep state again. I am. I love the deep state. I mean,

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_01]: the politicians come and go. The deep state remains. Erica is well sourced in the deep state.

[00:13:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Look, you know that again, this is a defend, suddenly defend cuts to the Seattle channel

[00:13:20] [SPEAKER_01]: or hopefully Brian Calleans. Yeah. This is largely a status quo budget, right? The whole

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_01]: big like, oh, big cuts are coming and you know, there's no way to do this without progressive

[00:13:32] [SPEAKER_01]: revenue. None of that stuff materialized, right? So there are some cuts here. I will say that

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Seattle channel cuts did jump out at me. I don't quite know what the, you know, the backstory

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_01]: there is. As Erica pointed out, it's not like a ton of savings. So but that is pretty public

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_01]: facing. I mean, it's not like your normie Seattle. I just watching the Seattle channel

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_01]: very much, but people do, right? Insiders do. And so... And it's like the place where the

[00:14:02] [SPEAKER_00]: city council and the mayor like give long form interviews and they don't really do that anywhere

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_00]: else, especially not on TV, you know, or internet TV. Nowhere else, really. Nowhere else, not even

[00:14:11] [SPEAKER_01]: public radio anymore. Not long form. Yeah. So that did jump out at me. I was not expecting

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_01]: that coming from the mayor and I'm kind of wondering what the backstory there is. I

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_01]: haven't talked to anybody or asked anybody, but I'm going to try to find out.

[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_02]: It reminds me a little of the 90s when former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani, you probably

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_02]: don't know this, but he steps in and tried to kill NPR station WNYC.

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I remember that. I remember them talking about it.

[00:14:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. And at a certain point... What's the station making art of like crucifixes of

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Christ and bottles of piss? What's that? Well, they weren't not doing that.

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Radio people are not doing that. They weren't pro Giuliani, you know. And so in response,

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_02]: they actually created this show with Curtis Sliwa. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. He just ran for mayor of

[00:15:01] [SPEAKER_02]: New York City. Guardian Angel ran for mayor Republican. He was the Republican that Eric Adams

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_02]: beat in... Yeah, they created this conservative show for a while. He was a guardian angels guy.

[00:15:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Which... Guardian angels. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think it lasted.

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And eventually donors stepped in to basically save the station by buying the license from this.

[00:15:22] [SPEAKER_01]: They gave Curtis Sliwa a show on public radio? That's hilarious.

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_02]: But my point, Erica, if these cuts go through of the Seattle Channel,

[00:15:32] [SPEAKER_02]: this is like... We've already lost the PI a long time ago, but local media around

[00:15:38] [SPEAKER_02]: the country is impoverished. It's just kind of shocking to me that it's even being proposed

[00:15:42] [SPEAKER_02]: and there seems to be a lot of tweeting about it even by Sarah Nelson. So what do you think is

[00:15:47] [SPEAKER_00]: going to happen here? I mean, I don't know. Sandeep should call his buddy Sarah Nelson and lobby her

[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_00]: to restore this cut because she seems receptive to that. I mean, this is pure speculation, but

[00:15:59] [SPEAKER_00]: rather observation. I do not believe that this mayor's office has been particularly a friend

[00:16:04] [SPEAKER_00]: to transparency nor this council. And I know there have been kerfuffles with the Seattle

[00:16:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Channel over some of its coverage that wasn't sufficiently flattering. I think some people

[00:16:15] [SPEAKER_00]: came into office thinking that Seattle Channel worked for them and their job was to promote

[00:16:20] [SPEAKER_00]: the council and to promote the mayor. And this is based on my deep state conversations, of course.

[00:16:26] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this is not a secret that transparency has really suffered over the last... I mean,

[00:16:32] [SPEAKER_00]: not just this mayor's term but the last mayor's term too. So it seemed like a blow against

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_01]: transparency to me. I think there have been some transparency issues. I mean, Erica,

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_01]: I think you have done Yeoman service in single-handedly restoring the staff directory, right?

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Public records request that got taken down and under the previous administration. And I do

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_01]: think I hear a lot of people across the board ideologically saying that was a really terrible

[00:17:02] [SPEAKER_01]: blow to transparency, right? To take away the online staff directory where you could look up

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_01]: anybody at the city and find the phone number. We could call them up, right? And ask a question

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_01]: or whatever. That all got taken down. So I think that is... I will say this. I have...

[00:17:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I know Brian Callihan at the Seattle Channel. I've been on actually KRW's Week in Review with

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_01]: him. Seems like a good guy. I have heard some complaints from folks that the Seattle Channel

[00:17:31] [SPEAKER_01]: coverage is much more sympathetic sometimes to the left side of the political divide in Seattle,

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_01]: the left moderate divide. So I think... I mean, I heard some complaints too. I don't think they're

[00:17:42] [SPEAKER_01]: accurate. Well, I don't watch it enough to render judgment on that but I definitely have heard that

[00:17:48] [SPEAKER_00]: complaint. And I think I know exactly who you're talking about. Well, maybe you do and maybe

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_00]: you don't but I'll not say it. I hope they restore Seattle Channel coverage and, you know,

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_00]: and I'm gonna raise a stink personally. As a member of the media, I feel invested in this.

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_02]: So... It makes your life harder, right? It makes your life harder.

[00:18:08] [SPEAKER_00]: It does. I've learned things from Seattle Channel programs because people are sitting down for

[00:18:12] [SPEAKER_00]: these longer interviews. And even though I think Brian is incredibly fair and balanced,

[00:18:17] [SPEAKER_00]: like to an extent that like, you know, I think is a little excessive sometimes.

[00:18:22] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, he's very friendly but like he gets people to say things and that's important.

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't have that kind of access. You know, most people don't or that kind of time with these

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_02]: folks. It's really valuable. Yeah. He is great. A real resource as the rest of this,

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_02]: you know, the rest of the staff at Seattle Channel too. And Erica, let's talk more about this

[00:18:41] [SPEAKER_02]: budget. The other piece that you pull out, it's kind of like a bit of a law and order

[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_02]: budget. Can you talk a little bit about Harold's priorities when it comes to

[00:18:50] [SPEAKER_00]: that public safety? Yeah. I mean, there's, you know, a bunch of stuff for putting,

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, new police patrols, as I mentioned, patrols in the emphasis areas, which,

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, basically overlap with the new soap and soda banishment zones that we've talked about

[00:19:04] [SPEAKER_00]: before. There's $10 million for overtime. Of course, the police have a, as we've also

[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_00]: talked about, a very large slush fund in their own budget of unfilled positions that just get

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_00]: funded every year. But instead of using that, they're going to appropriate more money to that.

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_00]: What else? I mean, there's a lot of funding for, you know, sort of beautification stuff,

[00:19:24] [SPEAKER_00]: which isn't exactly law and order, but it is like graffiti rangers and stuff that the mayor,

[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, I mean, the mayor has said he really hates graffiti. And I think it really does

[00:19:33] [SPEAKER_00]: bug him. And, you know, so there's just a lot of, you know, a lot of emphasis on police.

[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_00]: And oh yeah, there's also the jail contracts plural. The city is going to be spending a bunch of money,

[00:19:46] [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's $2 million in 2025, $2.7 in 2026 to do a contract with the score jail

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00]: down in Des Moines. And they're also renting more beds at King County Jail to hold some

[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_00]: of these people that they're going to be arresting on things like prostitution,

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_00]: loitering and drug use. So yeah, it's a lot of new money being put into those purposes.

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Big bonuses for cops, right? For lateral moot.

[00:20:11] [SPEAKER_00]: Well that's coming out of the slush fund. I can say that for it.

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_02]: And also CCTV cameras, which you've written about, but I don't think we've had a chance to talk about.

[00:20:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the budget for that was supposedly going to be around $1.8 million. It's actually

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_00]: going to be higher than that. It's going to be over $2 million in this budget. And yeah,

[00:20:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, cameras everywhere, people, I mean, not everywhere in the neighborhoods

[00:20:34] [SPEAKER_00]: we discussed last time. And people to staff that, you know, that real-time crime center and sit and

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_00]: I guess look at those cameras as well as potentially people's ring cameras that feed into the system.

[00:20:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Again, like if we're talking about a frugal budget or trying to be

[00:20:51] [SPEAKER_00]: the good governance mayor and council, you know, I'm not sure huge expenditures on these,

[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, our substantial expenditures much bigger than what is going into the care team,

[00:21:02] [SPEAKER_00]: the alternative responders. Not sure that this is like the time to start experimenting in new areas,

[00:21:08] [SPEAKER_00]: but you know, according to SID, of course, we've just got all this free magic extra money.

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_01]: We do. There's lots of free magic extra money. There really was.

[00:21:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, incredible. Just incredible.

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_01]: It's really great to have free magic extra money. I mean, you know, I think I do think

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: one of my big takeaways was this budget shows that all the sort of dire projections about

[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_01]: deficit this and that were kind of overblown. But also, but if we're talking about ads to the

[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_01]: budget, we would be remiss. We did not mention right there's a $2 million ad in there about

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Cathy Moore's basically to help address sex trafficking on Aurora, right? That part of

[00:21:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Cathy Moore sort of soap proposal that just passed, right? She said she wanted to come back

[00:21:51] [SPEAKER_01]: in the budget process and add some funding related to sex workers. And so the mayor is

[00:21:55] [SPEAKER_01]: proposing a additional $2 million to help address sex trafficking.

[00:21:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Very vaguely defined. It is vaguely defined, but it is $2 million.

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_00]: This is true. And they're also adding $1.5 million, I think for the care department,

[00:22:07] [SPEAKER_00]: which goes out with police to respond to non-emergency calls. The new investments in

[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_00]: the policing side of things and the jail side of things far, far outweigh what they're

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_00]: doing on the other side. So as I said in my piece, the council in particular always talks

[00:22:27] [SPEAKER_00]: about, well, we've got to do all these new laws and we've got to crack down on drug

[00:22:33] [SPEAKER_00]: users and sex workers, but we're going to do the carrot too. And the carrot, as far

[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_00]: as I can tell is about $3.5 million, that $2 million for Cathy Moore said it's going

[00:22:45] [SPEAKER_00]: to go to rest and the more we love. And then $1.5 million for the care team. It's not a lot of money.

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_01]: I think the mayor is trying to throw a bone to both sides here. Yeah, he's increasing funding for

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_01]: public safety and policing stuff. He's putting more money into the care team. He made sure that

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_01]: they funded the Equitable Development Initiative, which had been a subject of controversy earlier

[00:23:08] [SPEAKER_01]: this year. So I think if I'm Bruce Harrell, I'm feeling pretty good that I've checked a lot of boxes

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_01]: and touched a lot of political bases with this budget proposal coming in. And yeah,

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_01]: he's going to get some carpeting from the people who are like, you shouldn't touch any

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_01]: of the jumpstart money ever because there are these tablets from God about how it should be

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_01]: spent. But I think overall, he's producing a, like I said at the beginning, a pretty status quo

[00:23:44] [SPEAKER_01]: budget that evaporates all the talk of big cuts. Well, I mean, the talk of big cuts was always

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_00]: assuming that jumpstart would be funding its original purpose and not used as a slush fund

[00:23:56] [SPEAKER_00]: for any purpose whatsoever. But I also want to just point out, I mean, you said that it

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_00]: focuses on public safety. I don't think that this is a wild-eyed, lefty fucking thing to say,

[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_00]: but what provides public safety is affordable housing. What provides public safety is when people

[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_00]: have a place to live when they don't have to worry about making their next buck, when they

[00:24:19] [SPEAKER_00]: don't have to resort to things like dealing drugs, things like sex work, when people are

[00:24:24] [SPEAKER_00]: stable and secure in their homes. And it is a hell of a lot cheaper to fund things like the care team,

[00:24:32] [SPEAKER_00]: yes, but also to find affordable housing, which is something that we have for years. It's not

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_00]: something that is subject once you build it to the vicissitudes of this year's budget

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and wanting to please some political ally by looking tough on crime. And so I just want

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_00]: to say philosophically, I believe in public safety too. I just think that it can be provided at

[00:24:58] [SPEAKER_00]: cheaper cost by investing in things that last and aren't just like emphasis patrols where a bunch of

[00:25:04] [SPEAKER_00]: cops swarm third and pine and arrest a bunch of people. I don't think that's a very effective

[00:25:08] [SPEAKER_02]: use of resources. There was a piece in The Stranger talking about a multi-hundred

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_02]: dollar gap from the previous budget basically saying that Mayor was poised to cut an additional

[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_02]: $260 million out of this budget. So that's not happening here, right?

[00:25:29] [SPEAKER_00]: That's a deficit that we're both talking about. Sandeep is just saying that the

[00:25:33] [SPEAKER_00]: hue and cry was nothing because the Mayor fixed it. And I'm saying the Mayor fixed it by

[00:25:38] [SPEAKER_00]: yanking a bunch of money that was allocated to other purposes.

[00:25:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, right.

[00:25:42] [SPEAKER_00]: And by the way, the Mayor wasn't on the council then. I doubt he would have voted for this.

[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_00]: But who knows? But the Seattle Metro Chamber of Commerce not only opposed it but sued and lost

[00:25:55] [SPEAKER_00]: twice to kill Jumpstart. And now they're issuing these glowing press releases praising the Mayor for

[00:26:01] [SPEAKER_00]: his incredible foresight in not raising taxes. And the only reason they're not raising taxes

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_00]: is because of this other tax that they opposed. So there's a lot of sort of both sides of

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_00]: their mouth talk that's happening right now. That may be true. That other tax they imposed

[00:26:14] [SPEAKER_01]: raises a fuck ton of money, man. I mean, it's like 400 plus million bucks.

[00:26:19] [SPEAKER_00]: But it wouldn't have passed as a slush fund, Sandeep. It wouldn't have passed as a slush fund.

[00:26:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it wouldn't have passed the last council.

[00:26:27] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. And I don't think the current council, I mean, they've said no new taxes. There's

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_00]: no way they'd stick their necks out to pass or random slush fund tax for anything.

[00:26:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so I mean, it's just, I just think there's a lot of hypocrisy happening now with people who

[00:26:41] [SPEAKER_00]: are calling this extra money and acting like it, you know, to quote Sandeep, descended on high from

[00:26:47] [SPEAKER_01]: God. Yeah. I'm stone tablet. Yes. Yes. But with Teresa Mosqueda in a beard in a row playing Moses.

[00:26:56] [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, you know, I mean, it didn't, yeah, it didn't fall out of the sky.

[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, it wasn't and it wasn't designed to be a slush fund.

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_00]: And just because that's what it now is, is not really something to celebrate,

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER_00]: especially if you oppose the tax in the first place.

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_02]: This, the stranger's question was that this budget would end up reflecting Republican ideology.

[00:27:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Erica, what about that? Does this budget, is it a reflection of Republican ideology?

[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, isn't that Ron Davis's post?

[00:27:24] [SPEAKER_00]: It's in the stranger.

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:27:27] [SPEAKER_02]: But it's in the stranger.

[00:27:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I like, I don't, I don't really care to indulge in, you know, calling people Republicans.

[00:27:34] [SPEAKER_00]: They're, I mean, certainly there's, you know, an argument to be made that some of them,

[00:27:38] [SPEAKER_00]: the council would have been Republicans, you know, 40 years ago.

[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_00]: But I mean, I just, I think that it is just the sort of typical thing they're,

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_00]: they're reflecting their values and their values are, you know, police, jail,

[00:27:51] [SPEAKER_00]: criminalization and with a little, you know, sprinkling of, but we care in the form of,

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, $2 million for sex trafficking victims, which does not help the majority of workers,

[00:28:01] [SPEAKER_00]: of sex workers who are not trafficked, you know, and a little more money for the care team.

[00:28:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Sadip, let me put the question to you this way.

[00:28:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Hitler was a vegetarian.

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_02]: So was Mahatma Gandhi.

[00:28:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Therefore, Gandhi is a lot like Hitler. True or false?

[00:28:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. Yeah. True.

[00:28:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. I don't know where we're going with this question.

[00:28:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. True.

[00:28:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Where I was going to that question was, if somebody does something like somebody else.

[00:28:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you're asking me about Republicans and the, and the, oh.

[00:28:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Making that comparison is a logical fallacy.

[00:28:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And I tire of this because why not just say, look, you know, I want,

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I want the city to raise taxes.

[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want them to stop jumpstart.

[00:28:43] [SPEAKER_02]: Like why are we kind of obsessed with the Republican label?

[00:28:47] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you could even call somebody a conservative.

[00:28:49] [SPEAKER_02]: If you want a conservative Democrat or something that are fiscally conservative Democrat.

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_02]: No.

[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_02]: Why?

[00:28:54] [SPEAKER_02]: Sadip would yell at you.

[00:28:56] [SPEAKER_00]: You call anybody on the council.

[00:28:57] [SPEAKER_00]: I will.

[00:28:57] [SPEAKER_00]: I get it.

[00:28:58] [SPEAKER_02]: I get that, but, but I mean, it's more defensible like why,

[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_02]: why the obsession with this issue?

[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't get it.

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Now I'm seeing the stranger.

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_02]: It's so annoying.

[00:29:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway.

[00:29:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. I will just say.

[00:29:09] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm being troll here.

[00:29:09] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't care about the stranger as much as you guys do or,

[00:29:12] [SPEAKER_00]: or Ron Davis's op-eds.

[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_00]: The stranger.

[00:29:15] [SPEAKER_02]: All right. Well, enough of that then.

[00:29:18] [SPEAKER_02]: So Erica, you, as Sandeep said earlier, you,

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_02]: you have your finger in the pulse of the deep state.

[00:29:23] [SPEAKER_02]: So in a sense, you saw that.

[00:29:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And so does Sandeep really literally.

[00:29:27] [SPEAKER_02]: The question is, is the deep state still alive?

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, what do you,

[00:29:30] [SPEAKER_02]: what do you think the council is going to do with this?

[00:29:33] [SPEAKER_02]: I've seen some press releases that have come out and some,

[00:29:36] [SPEAKER_02]: some, you know, alternate priorities,

[00:29:38] [SPEAKER_02]: but what do you think is going to happen?

[00:29:40] [SPEAKER_00]: I think they're going to trim around at the edges.

[00:29:42] [SPEAKER_00]: I think they are very, very green, you know, still.

[00:29:44] [SPEAKER_00]: A lot of the questions that have been asked in the first budget briefing

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_00]: have been, I would say, maybe not shockingly basic at this point,

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_00]: but extremely basic.

[00:29:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Like, well, anyway, I won't go into specific examples,

[00:30:00] [SPEAKER_00]: but you know, I mean, you can watch the budget meetings.

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_00]: I think that they're, you know, still in a little deep and that,

[00:30:07] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, the changes are mostly going to be kind of on the margins and,

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and stuff that, you know, basically reflects the same priorities.

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there's going to be any big changes to this budget.

[00:30:15] [SPEAKER_00]: I will say this, I do think the mayor

[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_01]: built in some open-ended potential funding sources

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_01]: that if this council wants to add some spending to this budget,

[00:30:27] [SPEAKER_01]: they ought to be able to do so, I think without cutting,

[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_01]: potentially without cutting what the mayor's, you know, sort of,

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_01]: sort of priorities were.

[00:30:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I think that was probably done deliberately.

[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a point that Cavitz-Coffee made in a piece that he wrote in,

[00:30:41] [SPEAKER_01]: in post-Ali today.

[00:30:43] [SPEAKER_01]: I thought that was an interesting insight.

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_01]: So, so yeah, they're going to take around the edges.

[00:30:48] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I have heard some very preliminary chatter from some folks,

[00:30:53] [SPEAKER_01]: you know, on the second floor that, you know,

[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Erica, this will probably make your head explode,

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_01]: but they think there actually is maybe some potentially more stuff

[00:31:02] [SPEAKER_01]: to be done on the public safety front.

[00:31:04] [SPEAKER_01]: And so we could see some ads from this.

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_00]: You mean the police specifically?

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.

[00:31:10] [SPEAKER_01]: I have not heard specifics about what,

[00:31:12] [SPEAKER_01]: what they would want to do exactly.

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't, I don't know.

[00:31:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know for sure yet.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure they know, but I have heard some talk that like,

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_01]: there's interest maybe in looking at some public safety ads

[00:31:25] [SPEAKER_01]: to the budget.

[00:31:26] [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see.

[00:31:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, I also want to bring up, you know,

[00:31:28] [SPEAKER_01]: not budget related, but something else that happened this week

[00:31:31] [SPEAKER_01]: that is of, I think, significance to the operations

[00:31:34] [SPEAKER_01]: of municipal governance in Seattle, which was that we,

[00:31:37] [SPEAKER_01]: there was just the big public memorial service

[00:31:40] [SPEAKER_01]: on Monday afternoon at Mohai for Charlie Royer,

[00:31:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Seattle's longest serving mayor, right?

[00:31:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Who served three terms from the late 70s to 1990

[00:31:53] [SPEAKER_01]: as mayor of Seattle and who was a friend of mine

[00:31:59] [SPEAKER_01]: and somebody who taught me an enormous amount about Seattle

[00:32:03] [SPEAKER_01]: and how its politics and government worked.

[00:32:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And I think who was a major transformational figure

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_01]: during the time, those 12 years that he was mayor of Seattle,

[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_01]: who's a former journalist and great writer.

[00:32:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And I helped to a little bit to help pull that memorial service

[00:32:19] [SPEAKER_01]: together and just a very funny aside that the Seattle Times,

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_01]: because I helped write the press release announcing

[00:32:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Charlie's passing and the Seattle Times,

[00:32:29] [SPEAKER_01]: their story about it that day called me the

[00:32:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Royer family spokesperson, which is something

[00:32:33] [SPEAKER_01]: that the Royer family continues to laugh about

[00:32:36] [SPEAKER_01]: and joke at me.

[00:32:38] [SPEAKER_01]: But nonetheless, like Charlie was a major figure

[00:32:42] [SPEAKER_01]: in my political growth and development in Seattle

[00:32:47] [SPEAKER_01]: and it was a lovely celebration of his many, many, many achievements.

[00:32:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And it was a great event where draw through hundreds of people

[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_01]: that was a kind of cross section of at least

[00:32:59] [SPEAKER_01]: sort of this Seattle of that era.

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_00]: That sounds lovely. I wish I could have been there.

[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't know Charlie super well.

[00:33:06] [SPEAKER_00]: I know his wife who has worked with you, Sonny,

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_00]: and yeah, I mean just a very different era,

[00:33:13] [SPEAKER_00]: I would say of both kind of like discourse

[00:33:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and the fact that he was the longest serving mayor

[00:33:20] [SPEAKER_00]: and we're never going to have somebody serve that long again.

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Right now, you're lucky if you get two terms.

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_00]: So really made a mark on the city.

[00:33:29] [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't know him at all really,

[00:33:31] [SPEAKER_02]: but we had him on KOW one time with three other former mayors

[00:33:35] [SPEAKER_02]: and even though I think he served the longest time ago,

[00:33:40] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure how he compared in terms of age to the other three,

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_02]: but he was really funny.

[00:33:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Like really, really a funny guy.

[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, here's to Charlie Royer.

[00:33:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Charlie was a very funny dude.

[00:33:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:33:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And people told us some funny stories

[00:33:53] [SPEAKER_01]: from his memorial service.

[00:33:55] [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, they had the flags at half staff that day

[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_01]: at City Hall and the mayor issued a proclamation about Charlie

[00:34:02] [SPEAKER_01]: and it was all lovely.

[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_02]: All right, that's it for another edition of Seattle Nice.

[00:34:06] [SPEAKER_02]: He's Sandeep Koushik.

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_02]: She's Erica C Barnett.

[00:34:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm David Hyde.

[00:34:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Our editor is Quinn Waller and thank you so much for listening.